Dwayne Blais - Player Development Coach Detroit Red Wings

In this episode we interview Dwayne on his move to Detroit and how he helps players of all levels improve their skills through building relationships.  Along with working in the NHL as a player development coach Dwayne is also the owner of Total Package Hockey in London Ontario. His goal is to develop players as well as people. We also discuss the vital role of parenting in raising young athletes - the right way. Dwayne shares with us how he makes connections with elite level athletes and how the best are always looking to get better.

Connect with Dwayne:
https://www.totalpackagehockey.ca

Connect with us:
https://linktr.ee/BenchmarkedPodcast

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Transcript

00:00:00:01 - 00:00:22:08
Unknown
Hey, team, welcome to Benchmarked. Thanks for joining us today, Coach Messier, along with my co-host, Coach Larocque. Today, we're pumped to have an amazing guest with us. And I'm going to turn it over to JG for the intro. Do you say amazing every time? I'm trying. I love it. Amazing. We say I cannot use the word elitist. If I listen to a bunch of podcasts and everyone's amazing.

00:00:22:08 - 00:00:50:04
Unknown
 I'm not like this. That's what I'm saying. That's exactly right. Super amazing. Before super, super weird passes by the English department and super fly. Yeah. So today's guest is born and raised in northern Ontario in Sudbury, attended because go there, Catholic L.A. retires and the flowers in and then the middle lake, the big minnow. That's right. 
I was fortunate enough to have an athletic scholarship to play down Alabama.

00:00:50:04 - 00:01:15:11
Unknown
Huntsville played some pro hockey open his own business in London called Total Package Hockey and now is moved round and now working with an NHL club as a player development coach. But what's even cooler is he is a father, husband of two awesome awesome kids that I'm probably going to have to raise through a podcast because I don't know what kind of job he's doing as a parent, but luckily he has a great wife.

00:01:15:11 - 00:01:35:08
Unknown
And Gina. Yeah. Dwayne Blais, everybody....How's it going, guys? Thanks for having me on. Appreciate you joining us. That's kind of hammer J.J. on one thing, though, it's a total package talking about total total player hockey stats. Oh, yeah. That's that's a thing. But but do you ever see that, like, an average you ever see that in advertising where they screw it up?

00:01:35:08 - 00:01:52:03
Unknown
Because then people really pay attention, like, yeah, that's you guys double checking that. So that it was not sure. Just seconds. Pretty hard to talk to that the yeah. I could just see I know this is going to be a good show. You're starting off. You're already throwing the traps at each other. This is good. This is good.

00:01:52:03 - 00:02:12:18
Unknown
Yeah. So the go ahead. And this is brought to you by Beck. Beck as the official sponsor of his podcast for tonight. Yeah. Yeah. Okay, I'm good now. I'm good. I'm good. And we got great. Wait, hang on him and send us any money. So I forget that T-shirt. No free outlet free ads, but we have. Yeah, Duane, it's awesome that you're with us.

00:02:12:18 - 00:02:34:08
Unknown
And even though I like giving you a hard time. This is good. This is good. I got somebody else to join in on it with me. Exactly. Like I get all wrong for sure. So are you in Detroit right now, or are you are you back home? What? No, I'm in Detroit, so. Yeah, so we are kind of we are going on on Gigi's intro, I end up taking a job with the Detroit Red Wings this year.

00:02:34:08 - 00:02:59:18
Unknown
So it's kind of happened like in August is really quick. So just to give a bit of background I run skill development stuff in London, Ontario, and we worked as a bunch of players, young players and three or four years old all the way the NHL guys. And it's been it's been awesome. And previously this I worked at the Washington Capitals, which was unreal, but I was able to travel in and outside live in London, and I did fly to Washington for the first three years.

00:02:59:18 - 00:03:17:00
Unknown
I was just in Hershey, which is the NHL team. So I work with them with the prospects, and I fly outside where they're playing junior and go ski with them and meet with them and watch them play and stuff. So I did that for five years. Last two years, that contract that was up with the big club as well was kind of flying in Washington to work with the guys there, which is which is really, really cool.

00:03:17:00 - 00:03:34:17
Unknown
And then COVID hit everything kind of went weird. So I didn't renew my car. I didn't renew contract with Washington after when COVID hit. And then I was trying to focus on the on our business. And as anyone in Canada and especially Ontario, there's a lot it was tough. There's a lot of school closures, rink closures. It was a bit of a mess.

00:03:34:17 - 00:03:51:05
Unknown
So with all that, I stayed in London, obviously, and just try to kind of work through that. And then this past August, Detroit did call they were looking for a school, kind of a skilled coach to come in and help out with the team. So originally when I got talking to them, I went to the end of the interview process.

00:03:51:05 - 00:04:04:18
Unknown
I thought to be able to travel in and out of London, which would have been great. And that's kind of the before it was fine. My wife was good with that. And then as we went down the process, they kind of said, yeah, but, you know, after we kind of got to know you, whatever, and the role we want, we'd like you to be here every day.

00:04:04:23 - 00:04:20:14
Unknown
So we'd like you to, you know, you can commute, but it's a two hour drive there and back every day, which would have been a mess. And so, like, we like to move here if you could. So that was a whole different conversation with my wife, my kids, and but everyone was on board. My wife was like, Let's do it'll be a cool experience.

00:04:20:14 - 00:04:38:01
Unknown
So yeah, we moved here in September and we've been here for the year so far and it's been awesome that it's been really cool. You're looking at East Coast wife, man. They're the battle all go easygoing. Just go with the flow droplets. I hit the jackpot. Yeah, I played summer ball in Detroit. I actually loved it. I thought it was unreal.

00:04:38:09 - 00:04:58:05
Unknown
It's awesome. It's such an underrated town. Yeah, it was amazing. And like anybody that we told, they were moving to Detroit, like what do they call Heads on Purpose City? Everyone's got guns, you know? It's just like and I have no apprehensions. I lived in the States for a lot of years when I was in school and play.

00:04:58:05 - 00:05:13:24
Unknown
And I love the I love the States. I love the way they worked on here. I love it. But so for my wife to like, she never lived down here, obviously. And so we were kind of charitable and she's adventurous and she's like, let's go, let's do it. And it's been amazing that even the downtown, like the downtown core, Detroit is awesome.

00:05:13:24 - 00:05:34:06
Unknown
Like, they got all their sports fields right around each other. You can walk each one of them like football, baseball, hockey. It's getting rejuvenated. All the restaurants down there and stuff, which is great. Like, I jogged through there when when the weather's nice. I was jogging downtown and never felt like it was awesome. It was great. And everyone kind of lives like you would in any major city, kind of outside the city, a little bit like 20 minutes outside.

00:05:34:09 - 00:05:52:12
Unknown
And those like we live in a little spot called Troy. And anyone who's ever been in Somerset Mall, it's kind of like, George, you would never shop there. It's got like Gucci and all those guys. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's crazy, but so we're right around there, but it's awesome. Like, great, great neighborhood, really, really good schools. My kids have loved it.

00:05:52:12 - 00:06:13:05
Unknown
My wife's like, really enjoyed it, and it's been awesome and it's been really good, so I can't. I have nothing bad to say, man. It's been, it's been a really, really cool experience for my family. And our in this section has been brought to us by Detroit. The greatest community in America. Back to you, Marc. He's giving us what you don't you you sell in real estate, you on the side.

00:06:13:05 - 00:06:32:22
Unknown
Holy smokes. You don't want. It's funny because growing up in Saint Marie, I grew up as a Tigers fan because we were only a four and a half hour drive from Detroit versus an eight hour drive to Toronto. So my dad in the summertime would be like, we're going to the ballgame. We'll go see Detroit played Toronto, but we're going to Detroit.

00:06:33:07 - 00:06:48:16
Unknown
So it was really that was that was my youth growing up. Tiger, the old Tiger Stadium took my kids to the new Tiger Stadium. It was amazing. It was it was such, such a great town. Of course, I went to Central Michigan Universal. We were in and out of there for concerts and stuff like that all the time.

00:06:48:16 - 00:07:17:13
Unknown
But I grew to enjoy Detroit. Yeah, I know. It's cool. Yeah, it's awesome. Duane let's dig into something like, well, actually, we'll go to the some real stuff that the teaching part. So Mark and I talked about two influential people for us at a young age. I know you and I have talked and previously in podcasts in the past, but just in case we have some new listeners or whatever, who were some pretty big influences for you at a younger age?

00:07:17:13 - 00:07:34:04
Unknown
Let's say high school, it could be elementary or you know, in your, your youth, let's say, who are the influences and what do they bring to the table? So I think it like when I was young, young, young, I think my family was a big influence. Like my dad was a huge influence. My dad was a super supportive guy, obviously, and his past since.

00:07:34:04 - 00:07:47:04
Unknown
But he's been using a big, big part of me getting into hockey. I started late and started when I was nine. So anyone out there that plays any kind of sport, like I didn't start till I was nine and it wasn't because my parents, my parents asked my dad, us every year. You want to be hockey on hockey league?

00:07:47:04 - 00:08:05:03
Unknown
No, no, no. And then we would, you know, neighborhood, their kids were playing road hockey. My brother and I was a year younger than I. We started playing road hockey, these kids. And then when they came on Saturday, I want to play hockey like ice hockey. I think I have all of your both in the truck we're going get equipment and play it again.

00:08:05:03 - 00:08:30:15
Unknown
Sports. So but it was like I started honestly like my mom taught power skating. She was a figure skater. She taught power skating in in Sudbury for the city and she had you know, we could have been really good skaters. I was the worst skater on my team, like legit with equipment on we're skating on my team and my mom put us in a two week program like just a skating program with the with the city that she wasn't teaching.

00:08:30:15 - 00:08:56:21
Unknown
So other teachers taught us and any parent out there, you know what I mean? Like you go and they see their kids are trying to teach your kids like I already know that I already know that. So I never done that for nine years or six years. Whatever I try to learn on the other things my mom and she would I would listen to her long story short or can't skating and then fell in love with hockey and then in Sudbury we were very fortunate because there's outdoor rinks in every single area that we lived in, you know, so I remember waking up in the morning on a Saturday and being like one of my parents

00:08:56:21 - 00:09:10:06
Unknown
bedroom. We're still sleeping. Like I'm all the rage like and I'd grab my stuff and I walked out of the door, which is a ten minute walk, and my mom would show up at lunch and bring me lunch and I wouldn't come until dark like. And I do that all the time, you know? So my mom and dad were super supportive.

00:09:10:06 - 00:09:29:20
Unknown
I had an uncle to play. It was a good player. I'd never played high level, but, you know, just we had we had a really supportive family with grandparents, so like that. But I think one of the biggest people that kind of shifted me was I remember going to like Heritage. So we kind extricated that semester. No, I never going there in grade nine, and I was a prodigy.

00:09:29:20 - 00:09:43:12
Unknown
I was just I was an overweight kid. I was just a not because I was not active. I was just and for any kids out there gone through their parents that your kids are like this. Like, I was like, you know, I was a kid with huge sweaters that probably wouldn't even fit me to this day. They're way too big, you know?

00:09:44:00 - 00:10:00:10
Unknown
And I remember grade nine. I just I was my build and whatever, right? I was short, stocky and chubby. And I met Mrs. Back who was on Iran's back, who we had I had on my podcast and unbelievable guy. And he was just he was, you know, my dad's age. He knew my dad and he would run with us.

00:10:00:10 - 00:10:13:21
Unknown
You'd play rugby with us, he'd play basketball on us and he'd kick our bought most of the stuff you know. So I just I remember I remember vividly saying, like, regardless of sports, I was like, when I'm a dad, I want to be able to run with my kids. I want to be able play basketball, my kids, I want to be able to.

00:10:14:06 - 00:10:30:07
Unknown
And he was kind of a guy that really, like, shifted. I started I mean, from that point on, no joke in grade nine, ten, like a like we ran along. We did the cross country running and all that stuff. And from that point on, I never stopped running. Like, I run to this day, like, I enjoy jogging. I hated it at one point.

00:10:30:07 - 00:10:47:24
Unknown
Like, I remember my first couple of jogs were like a minute light jog, a minute walk, and I couldn't hardly do that, you know? And then so it's a process for any athlete out there that's trying to get better. But then I changed my body and they started working out and they started developing. And all these guys, I have shoulders, I have packs instead of boobs.

00:10:47:24 - 00:11:05:24
Unknown
This is amazing. You know, I could wear my I'd take my shirt off on a swim, you know, like I was like the worst the worst shirt swimming and our guys, like, nice boobs, like, you know, so I, you know, and so it's just no one. But he was probably one of the biggest guys, the biggest people in my, my life to just kind of like shift my mentality a little bit and only by example.

00:11:05:24 - 00:11:22:16
Unknown
It's not like he came to me and said, hey, you got to get better shape. And I thought it just was you don't have it naturally. You know, I still remember. Great. Well, I think it was Pacer test. I think you'd have me like a 12 or 13. And now that, you know, we're older and kind of see things in a different light, just even him being proud.

00:11:22:16 - 00:11:37:20
Unknown
You're not even his kid or any of it. I don't know who else we were running with. It was there was that far excuse me, in the Pacer test and just him being, like, happy for people succeeding pure it didn't matter what was could have been doing the beam, you know what I mean? Yeah. Gymnastics, like, didn't matter.

00:11:37:20 - 00:11:55:04
Unknown
It just. Yeah, I know what you're talking about. Yeah, definitely. It sounds like. And it's too bad like it. It sounds like no kids should have to go through that in their youth, really being self-conscious about that. And because you do grow out of it at some point, right? And it's you take care of it at some point.

00:11:55:04 - 00:12:09:13
Unknown
And there's, there's a light at the end of the tunnel. It's too bad that kids are meant to feel that way. Right? Like it's insane. You know what? I think it's tough. I really do. I look back on it for me personally and not everyone's like this, but those are things that help me get stronger. I'll be honest with you.

00:12:09:13 - 00:12:26:03
Unknown
Like, you know, I had parents that would be I'd say I'm fat or whatever. They know you're you know, you look great. You're you're athletically, you're fine, you know, and I'd be like, I know I have cellulite on my stomach. Like, I know, like I knew that as a kid and every kid knows this. Right. But my parents are very supportive, you know?

00:12:26:03 - 00:12:39:12
Unknown
And I remember going for jogs with my mom in the morning, like, my mom would get up in the morning sometimes. And she'd just go run, and she just was going for a run. And I'm like, Mom, I'm going to come with you. And I run with her, you know, like and so I had parents that were like promoting that a little bit.

00:12:39:12 - 00:12:57:10
Unknown
Never told me, hey, when you got to come up for a run, she wasn't running because of me. She was just running, but and always made me feel confident with it, even though inside I was like, I know I'm big. I know I'm and I wasn't you know what I mean? It's just so I think for kids sometimes and parents especially, like, it's I can't imagine how heart wrenching it is.

00:12:57:10 - 00:13:17:04
Unknown
Like, I've got two young kids and I've got a daughter and body image becomes an issue like body image. That young is my daughter's seven and already there's certain things her hair or her stomach and skin. Yeah, what you name it, hit puberty and it's yeah, it's crazy. And you're trying to be they're beautiful and they're athletic and you're like, no, you're fine with the worry about it.

00:13:17:04 - 00:13:36:02
Unknown
But even even though you see that in their mind, they already know they already know where they're at, right? So it's just helping them find ways to escape that, find ways to, like, get more confidence and encourage them to be more confident. You know what if that's an athlete on your team, a girl, a female male on your team, or if it's a daughter, son, like, you know, we all go through this stuff and it's normal.

00:13:36:02 - 00:13:51:18
Unknown
And that's the one thing I find is with a lot of stuff, no one really talks. And sometimes you don't talk about it, you know, like even having kids like. Yeah, having kids was unbelievable. It was the shittiest years I've had, like, let's be honest. Like, that was like all the rest of my life was on my butt when my wife be like, Are you insane?

00:13:52:09 - 00:14:17:12
Unknown
That's the worst day in my life. Like, my wife was screaming, There's Blood Everywhere is a massive gong show, and I was going to leave the hospital in two days with somebody I don't know. And I had no idea how to race out in Vegas for three days and oh, that's all. Come on. Like as I can see a slipper coming around the corner and I all my wife's heard this many times, but and I love my kids, but you know what I mean?

00:14:17:14 - 00:14:36:06
Unknown
It's hard I've been parents hard, so there's no I know there's no master's degree. And being a parent, you're doing it. You wake up in the morning and there's some curve ball coming at you, right? For sure. And I remember going through, like, pregnancy, our first kid, honestly, everybody, like, you didn't go through the janitor, but anyways, but I was part of it, okay?

00:14:36:06 - 00:14:56:07
Unknown
I was a big part of it. But a lot of dads can relate to this, but I remember going through it anyways, like reading every book on, like, you know, the baby whisperer baby whispering like, Duane, you should be reading this stuff. Like, I am not reading anything because nobody knows how to raise a kid. Like, I don't care how many books you read, like in a shirt off, like, I stuff a lot of stuff.

00:14:56:07 - 00:15:13:00
Unknown
But like, you, you just, you learn, you know, I think I'm a good person. I think I can teach. I think I can I am might, you know, I think I can handle stressful situations. And we went through it fine. So for our kids are walking, talking, brushing their teeth. We're good, but it's like it's a grind, man.

00:15:13:02 - 00:15:32:09
Unknown
And so and those are kids now. My little guy's nine. My little my my my girl seven. Oh. So yeah, you can still you can still run them and I would skate them and I I'm right. It's come it's coming up quick though. We think it was two summers ago when I got beaten a foot race. I was devastated for sure.

00:15:32:09 - 00:16:07:07
Unknown
Yeah. And the punches actually hurt after you got you got to pull your feet can I go on. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Michael Johnson. Michael Johnson. Exactly. Yeah, that's exactly. It's just such a terrific thing to go through though. But I think a good coach could be a good parent and a good parent could be a good coach. And I feel like people fall short where they're lacking on some, like sometimes a coach could use a little bit better parenting skills or that parent could use a little bit better coaching skills, especially when we're coming in like and I'm running into more and more boys lacking confidence.

00:16:07:07 - 00:16:30:06
Unknown
One of the things we talked about on our show is confident confidence is not a light switch that you go on and off. You got to treat it more like a dimmer, like it'll dip a little bit, but you can bring it back up again. Right? So and dealing with those setbacks. So parenting and that's why we say like, yeah, we're a leadership, mental performance and coaching show, but there's you can't do that type of stuff, those three, without including parenting in there either.

00:16:30:06 - 00:16:51:04
Unknown
So. Well, that's a massive and Gigi and I talked will just like we have the kids for an hour a day, 2 hours a day as a coach, you know what I mean? And then the other, you know, ten, 12 hours they're awake. Let's say they're at school or they're with their parents or anything you've done in an hour 2 hours has been super positive, super reinforce, and then they go home and it's bad, you know, whatever it is, right?

00:16:51:07 - 00:17:13:12
Unknown
A situation or whatever a lot of stuff gets undone pretty quick. So you're right. I think it's, it's a, you know, a lot of times with coaches, especially the young kids, you're helping the parents coach the kids as well, or parent the kid as well. Sometimes, you know, there's been a lot of tough conversations with parents over the years where, you know, you're letting them you tell them like, no, they can't be on Piers.

00:17:13:12 - 00:17:32:01
Unknown
Five or four till one in the morning. You know what I mean? Oh, no, you can't let them have their devices in their bedroom. Like this is you know what I mean? So there's a lot of things like that. Are you sure you're not a teacher or I'm not. I don't want the full wishes. He wishes. Yeah. I remember you're saying that story started.

00:17:32:17 - 00:17:55:10
Unknown
I remember coaching with Best wasn't a rookie ball. So like the pitching machine, we play a first game and there's a Dairy Queen literally right across the street and we're about to start the second game. Right now at the lineup and do my thing. A kid shows up and he's eight or nine years old with like and there's an extra, extra, extra large blizzard that's what he had.

00:17:55:14 - 00:18:11:21
Unknown
So again, I'm just like I'm like looking over. I'm like, what is going on right now? And I was like, Kate, you got to get rid of this. Felt bad after eight. A couple bites myself. But anyway, but I went to the same thing. I had to go to the parents. Like you can't really give them that much sugar like when we had to do this.

00:18:11:21 - 00:18:29:06
Unknown
Maybe like some water, but yeah, yes, it's it's a tough conversation. Like in your head, it makes sense. But sometimes you just don't know better. It's a reward for that. Like, I don't I don't know everybody's makeup and everyone's story, but I remember that exact story as soon as you said about staying, you know, staying up late and making all these different types of decisions.

00:18:29:06 - 00:18:46:11
Unknown
But no, but I think it's sometimes, too, with parents, it's like and it's not easy don't get me wrong. Yes. As we age the no, let's be honest. Right. But say no like you're saying. No, no, we're not doing that. Their kids are. I know you want to go. I know we've gone yesterday. You know we're not doing that.

00:18:46:11 - 00:19:07:17
Unknown
I think it's not easy to do that. But then like we just want to it's like my daughter didn't want to dinner okay, fine. I know I'm full. Okay, fine. But when you're hungry, like, that's your snack. Sure. And off like 20 minutes later, like, I'm starving. We'll go your food sure enough by then. And she had her plate of food and then she had snack after that.

00:19:07:17 - 00:19:24:14
Unknown
And I'm like, no, that's your food, Mommy. This we made this. Like, you're eating this. Like, there's no and that's Weezer for me just to give her all of our apple and whatever you want, I mean, and be on our way, go to bed. But I'm like, no, no, no, that's not how this works. Like, I barbecued mom made dinner like, no, this is what you're eating.

00:19:24:14 - 00:19:46:18
Unknown
So if you're hungry, then eat your food, and then you can. You know what? I'm not saying I'm a good parent, cause I do that, but I'm just saying it's way harder to do that. We'll just be like, I find you grab something, no problem, like, and then go to bed and reset tomorrow, you know? But for me, like, I think a lot of times when I see really good athletes at nine, ten, 11, and they're good kids and they hate things, coach.

00:19:46:18 - 00:20:03:17
Unknown
And they like the hardworking kids, that didn't happen at eight, nine, ten. That happened at like 23, four or five, six. You know what I mean by some of the values they were taught, by some of the things they went through, by how their parents, parents, them, like, you know, and then you see a kid at eight, nine, ten who's a complete off the rails train wreck, great athlete.

00:20:03:17 - 00:20:23:07
Unknown
Unbelievable. You know, one good kid, one on one, but just can't. Then you go back to two, three, four, five, six, you know, like, okay, I try to solve this just the environment he was and you know, so let's use that as an example then because I find that that can definitely be a challenge as a coach but that kid has athletic ability.

00:20:23:18 - 00:20:44:23
Unknown
You can't blame them for, you know, lack of influence, proper influence earlier on in their lives. Can we as coaches correct that over time? Because that's something that we can correct and what can we do to correct it? That's something that I know coaches struggle with all the time. That great talented kid, but is just developmentally behind that way.

00:20:46:22 - 00:21:04:19
Unknown
I think it depends on on their environment. I mean, honestly, like and that the parents are bought in doesn't matter. But I'm not saying about economics or financial situations. Nothing like that. Doesn't matter. But if, you know, if the parents are bought into the parents, they don't believe in the kid, in the parents or. No, you know, our in our into the player's development.

00:21:05:10 - 00:21:21:16
Unknown
Yeah, I think you can have a positive impacts but she's not a player has a bit of drive you know that players loves a sport of baseball or hockey or football, whatever that is. When they have that drive. I think that you can definitely you know, you can use that as a carrot. Right. And one of the things to you know, if you're not doing well academically well, you can't play football.

00:21:22:07 - 00:21:34:23
Unknown
If you're not doing well academically where you can't play hockey, you know, so you got to get you got to have your checks in order in order to be able to play the sport because that's what they love. Right. And the parents are like, no, it's okay. School's not a big deal, mom. I'll do your essay and then we're good.

00:21:34:23 - 00:21:54:21
Unknown
No, that'll slow your math quiz. And when that happens, like that happens more than you see levels with elite players. Like, I've got stories of players playing the NHL right now, making a lot of money, and I have hard examples of them. Their parents doing their essays from high school, and now they're going to be fine that they got they hit the jackpot.

00:21:54:21 - 00:22:12:13
Unknown
They're good players and it all worked out for them. But for every one of those, how many didn't, you know, didn't get it all, we're go for it. And how many are struggling now to get through university or find a job or keep a job or whatever, you know, who knows? Right. So, Dwayne, I remember we had we did a zoom, we had Blake Sloan, we talked to Blake Sloan.

00:22:12:13 - 00:22:33:04
Unknown
And then I remember you asking him the question remember the exact question. But I actually you talked about him having been traded back to teams he had played for because you had checked a little bit of his bio and then the comment you had for that was like when teams resign, you they obviously think highly of you if they want you back after a trade or whatever, you know, if they were trying to do a push or whatever it is.

00:22:33:08 - 00:22:50:17
Unknown
Yeah, but member Blake talking about you have to be an absolute douche, like in a stud, like in which said this like the one percenters basically like you can't be like that. You know, if you to be able to play in the league and be, you know, have longevity of a career so on so far you just of live that way.

00:22:51:10 - 00:23:10:01
Unknown
Yeah. And that's the thing like even now, like this team look at the NHL which I'm in or you know Major League Baseball, whatever that is. Like you have your leave of the elite. You have your pitchers that are going to get signed by their team because they're so good they can be off field office antics, whatever, but they're going to keep getting signed because of that good.

00:23:10:01 - 00:23:28:14
Unknown
You know, but for every one of those, there's probably another 100 players that are not that and that have to be, you know, good people, hard workers doing the right things, you know, appeasing coaches like and I'm not saying like falling in line you're awesome, but you got to like playing a role, know your role and do that to the best of your ability.

00:23:28:14 - 00:23:46:22
Unknown
You know, when a guy like Blackstone and Blake Sloan's one of many who's like probably a third liner, you know, a third line guy, fourth line guy or a fifth six DH, you know what I mean? Or go down the depth chart on the ball team. But he's a good guy. Guys love him. He's a team guy. He's team first guy like and he's made a lot of money play in the NHL for a lot of years.

00:23:46:22 - 00:24:01:15
Unknown
Want to stand up like I'd want done a lot of good things in hockey because he's a good guy. He works hard you know, and that's the one thing like it comes back to that, you know you got you guys like Connor McDavid and Sidney Crosby and these players that people look up to, they're like, Whoa, these guys are so good.

00:24:01:15 - 00:24:14:22
Unknown
I want to be that guy. Well, you're not going to be that guy, you guys. You know what I mean? Like, those guys are like, you know, generational players, you know? And we have a lot of them in the NHL right now, which is awesome. But, you know, the day for every one of those guys, you got three other lines of players.

00:24:14:22 - 00:24:35:14
Unknown
So nine other players see just on offense that are not that that are finding a way to be good NHL players, you know what I mean? And I think if you're you know, if you if you are choosing Chuck and the big thing with me is if you don't if you're going to play a sport, whether it's hockey, whatever it is, it's matter you have to be passionate about it and go for that kind of time and energy and you got to love it.

00:24:35:14 - 00:24:50:04
Unknown
And if you don't love and that's okay. And I told this to many kids, like, do you want to play triple-A or you don't want to play you know, a baseball? You want to be like, that's okay. You want to go back and play obviously with your boys, like, no problem. Then go do that and figure out other things that you like to do.

00:24:50:04 - 00:25:18:02
Unknown
You know what normal yeah, exactly right. But I've had students have to give the sport they loved and athletes that I've coached that have had to leave the sport they love, not on their own terms. Right. Injuries, whatever. And they struggle with that. And I what I tell them all the time is, you though, that you being a football player, basketball player or baseball player or a hockey player does not define you as a human being.

00:25:18:03 - 00:25:39:11
Unknown
That's hard, man. It's hard because some people leave the game on their own terms and that's okay. But for some that don't, they have to realize that if you've laid that foundational work, that gravitational center that you created, with family, hard work and character and all of the things that we talk about on our shows, about our nine elements, that you're set as a human being.

00:25:39:11 - 00:25:59:06
Unknown
And I think that's a hard one. And at some point, every athlete comes to an end, right? Every every athlete that they've got to hang it up for once, but you got to make sure that you have those skills in place to be a contributing member of society. Because if you were a donkey in the dressing room when you're a player, you're going to be a donkey in real world to guarantee.

00:25:59:15 - 00:26:18:00
Unknown
Mark and I talked about his or he transitional in that he talked about his transition from, you know, athlete, player to coach. What was your transition like from you know, your playing pro hockey, whatever he had to do. Then it turned into the coaching world. How was that? How'd you flip the switch? How did it work? How's it working?

00:26:19:06 - 00:26:45:20
Unknown
Well, going back on that. So, like, we've all been around families where everything is around little Johnny playing football and everything's going to be playing in the NFL or the CFL he's going to be pro and everything's like, hockey's bad for that. You like all the eggs in this basket, he's going to make the NHL. And then when that doesn't happen, that poor kid his whole identity, his whole life in hockey, you know, I was really fortunate in my my through my life, I my identity wasn't hockey.

00:26:45:20 - 00:27:09:01
Unknown
Like, my identity was 100% hockey in my mind. That's all I did. Like, I have a brother and a sister, both played instruments, have albums out there. They're very they're they're well-rounded. I played a hockey stick that's all I did. I worked out. I loved other sports. I you know, I played basketball. I played soccer. The cost of running and all those things I did was because I wanted to train for hockey and hockey was what I loved.

00:27:09:01 - 00:27:23:13
Unknown
I was it I was crazy about hockey. I was like, it's all going to blow over hockey. Like, that's all I wanted to do. So what happened with me was I had a good family around me where I was more than just hockey to my family, you know what I mean? My family really didn't care if I ever played hockey again.

00:27:23:24 - 00:27:38:07
Unknown
My wife that I married, who's unbelievable, could care less if I ever wore skates or how to stick my hand ever in my life. She is no. Which I love that. Like, I love that have always for whatever reason, even when I did a girls and whatever, like through high school and stuff, they didn't care about hockey, didn't they?

00:27:38:07 - 00:27:53:04
Unknown
Me because of the hockey player and I that was really important to me, you know what I mean? Like was just and I give credit to my family for that because it was never like at family gatherings. I was like, oh, doing my mom and dad running around the table. No, Duane scored two goals. All Dwayne's doing this, you know what I mean?

00:27:53:11 - 00:28:10:07
Unknown
But you hear about it. You talk to your parents sometimes about the weather and 3 seconds later, you're talking about Johnny scoring three goals in the tournament, the last boat. You know what I mean? It's just so I think at the end of the day, that's the biggest thing. So when I made that transition out of hockey, into like the real world, and that was my decision.

00:28:10:07 - 00:28:28:00
Unknown
And I probably looking back on, I've no regrets, but I love practicing. I love playing. It was the year of the lockout. I was going to go to Europe. So the NHL locked out. I was going to go play over in Europe and a bunch of guys like a bunch of high end NHL guys all over Europe. So their jobs are scarce I was going to play the copy league.

00:28:28:00 - 00:28:46:23
Unknown
I was like, I'm not going to do that. And then I got a call to go back to play where I was playing the year before, and I was like, I just like this business in London. I just bought a house. I was like, I'm just going to stay. And I'm I'm glad I did a total package. Hockey told me this Friday, I dossier, I dossier on so be sure to take the lay off for sure.

00:28:47:06 - 00:29:07:03
Unknown
But then so then I got to ask to go coach on the QMJHL. So I got as a coach and CHL in Canada, which is a big deal. And so I did that. It was amazing, was an unreal experience. The, the head coach and I weren't we just didn't see eye to eye on how things were going. And I was like by time I saw this guy for another couple of years ago, I'm going to be miserable, number one.

00:29:07:03 - 00:29:24:23
Unknown
And number two, like, I don't know where this ship is going, so I'm going to go back to London. And that was one of the things were like other guys are to either and talk to you through this process of not going back. We're like I back or just they want you back or back. Like, who cares? You're coaching, like, oh, so me like I'll go back and run my business and I'll do my thing.

00:29:24:23 - 00:29:42:09
Unknown
Like, was just so I knew early on that I was just I was more than just hockey. If tomorrow hockey shut down and I couldn't do it anymore, I'd find something else to do. You know what I mean? But I do love it. Like, I still love it. So I'm very fortunate to be in a job and in a position, in a spot in life where I do enjoy what I do because I really do.

00:29:42:22 - 00:29:58:22
Unknown
But at the end of the day, you know, if I had to pivot in transition, I wouldn't. You know, I don't think I get depressed about I don't think I you know, I go crazy about it. You know what I mean? It it would suck. Don't get me wrong. But yeah, I think I think there's more to me than just not, you know, adapt to find and evolve.

00:29:59:17 - 00:30:21:21
Unknown
Right? Adapt and evolve. Yeah, it definitely you're not you're not defined by what you did and you're defined by who you are and what you're doing. Now, look, you went it's funny because a lot of the the four on that former athletes, I'm sure you're still an athlete, but a lot of the coaches that we interview on this show have had that transition happened kind of organically and they fall into the coaching world.

00:30:22:03 - 00:30:41:07
Unknown
You're still coaching, you're in the player development area. How do you find that like people especially with the Red Wings, do you do these guys that are at the pinnacle of sports are you coming in like, this guy's going to teach me how to skate and shoot and do that stuff? Do you find that at that level they're pretty receptive to the skill development and continuing to progress?

00:30:41:08 - 00:30:59:17
Unknown
Yeah, it's a great question. And like, I'd never play the NHL, right? They play professional hockey, but not at the NHL level. So I don't if I, if I played 500 games, that's a different conversation to begin with, right? For me, like even the first three or four months of this job, I going only four or five months and now was all building relationships.

00:31:00:03 - 00:31:15:11
Unknown
Like I can come in too hot and be like, Hey Joe, you got to work on you one time where you want to, you know? So for me it was not bad. It was like, did you help Alex Ovechkin with his one timer from the way yeah. That's like that's one of the things you lost all the time.

00:31:15:11 - 00:31:31:16
Unknown
The go. You work with all of you like I did like Adam in a small group of three guys. Awesome person, really good guy. But like I'm not going to over and be like, hey, you're techniques to get off on your 150 goals, you know, like you don't do it. But for a guy like him, it's just like building a bit of relationship with them and like, I'm not here to, like, tell you you're good or bad.

00:31:31:16 - 00:31:43:02
Unknown
I'm just going to, I'm going to give you some touches. I'm going to get some touches on something you like do what I'm going to use and touches. I may give you a little bit of feedback on stuff. So for me here in Washington, same thing is like just building relationships with the guys, you know what I mean?

00:31:43:02 - 00:31:57:10
Unknown
I was very fortunate when I was there. Tom Wilson. Unfortunately for him, I have like a big suspension. He had that 20 game suspension. So I went in a couple of times just to work with him one on one. So I got to know him really well and, and just worked with him. And it was really, it was fun.

00:31:57:10 - 00:32:10:17
Unknown
He was super receptive, but it was the first, you know, couple of hours were just building relationships. He could see that I could ski and I could move and I could demonstrate. That's a big thing for me is like if I'm going to be a strength coach, I'm going to be on a skills coach. I better be able to skate.

00:32:11:00 - 00:32:32:15
Unknown
I better be able to demonstrate. I do at the NHL level, I'm not playing the NHL, but I'd be able to do it at a good clip. I better be able to shoot. I better be able to demonstrate what I'm trying to get these guys to do, even if it's half speed, you know, and then have knowledge of what I'm teaching, you know, and then also to like a lot of guys coming to over the top way to technical and depending on the player you have some players love level and type techniques.

00:32:32:15 - 00:32:47:06
Unknown
Some players just wanted like a, b, c, boom, perfect, you know, so you got to get to know that. So my first three, four months here has just been literally like building relationships and getting to know guys and getting comfortable with them. And I'll send them some clips like, hey, this is what I've seen, like all men. It was awesome.

00:32:47:06 - 00:33:02:18
Unknown
Thanks a lot. Then they get to know how you see them, you know? And I'm also I've been fortunate in situations where I'm not taking ice time away, I'm not sitting anybody, I'm not benching anybody, like, and I'm, I'm kind of like the rah rah guy a little bit like, you know, I love these guys are all good.

00:33:02:18 - 00:33:16:22
Unknown
They all play in the NHL, you know what I mean? So they like, let's help them get better and hopefully they can help our team get better, you know? So that's kind of the role that I fit in. And then there's young prospects, you know, that we're harder on on like you have to do this to get to the next level.

00:33:16:23 - 00:33:35:00
Unknown
These are the steps you have to take when you got to play this way for your game to get to that next level. So that's a different conversation with those guys. But it's yeah, it's all about relationships. What was the go ahead, Marco. I'm just thinking about it. You grew up in Sudbury. You went to London and now you're in Detroit.

00:33:35:00 - 00:33:58:24
Unknown
Three of North America's biggest hockey communities. Like that's a there's got to be. Will you feel any pressure on that? Because I know London's a hotbed of hockey. Sudbury is a major hub in a hockey Detroit. Well, it's hockey town, right? So yeah, and I know Detroit is a storied organization. Did you feel a little bit of pressure or is it does it kind of do you like being in that like you're under the spotlight?

00:33:59:00 - 00:34:15:01
Unknown
Because you can't tell me that the parents that are sending their kids to train with you in London don't have bigger goals in mind for their kids and even the kids themselves. Yeah, I mean, like somebody I was young, so I love somebody when I was like 18. My family still there and I still go visit all the time and stuff, so I left.

00:34:15:08 - 00:34:34:20
Unknown
Well, you never told me you coming when I was after telling if I'm okay. Sorry, I ask you, go on the conversation so I left when I was like young and so I and my parents weren't political. Like, my parents weren't, weren't involved, but like the coaches and I made teams because I made teams as a ten forward on a 1014.

00:34:34:20 - 00:34:50:17
Unknown
You only need to work my way up the lineup and try to get better. And, you know, so, so leaving somebody was I was young was fine and then go to London. You're right, London is a hotbed. But I think the one thing that I that helped me in London was I was honest. Like I had played pro at that time.

00:34:50:17 - 00:35:03:20
Unknown
I'd play college play pro where a lot of kids want to go. And I was very honest and I was very and I wasn't doing it for the money like, yeah, I wanted to make a living doing it, but I did it because I enjoy doing it. And that's I think. And I still do it for that reason.

00:35:03:21 - 00:35:18:08
Unknown
I'll be honest with you. Like, I really enjoy what I do. So I think I ended up developing a bit of a group of players that really we developed. Like some of the kids I started with years ago. I still talk to one of them, get married, just call me as I get a gauge, you know what I mean?

00:35:18:09 - 00:35:33:17
Unknown
Like, I sold Texas like Boulevard, who I met when he was in Barnum, and a lot of the guys are playing the NHL to come to Detroit. I'll go for dinner with them or I'll meet up with them after the game, like, you know, so it's it's more for me about relationships sort of will come on my cancer come into my clinics, you know what I mean?

00:35:33:23 - 00:35:54:15
Unknown
So much for those higher hiring kids now coming to Detroit was I'd watch Detroit almost four years. The NHL, my eyes are bad and you know, all Lidstrom and all these guys, it's unbelievable that the roster had over the years. Right. And I didn't realize slight walked through the locker room they know now they have a new rank it's beautiful but I was like holy man.

00:35:54:15 - 00:36:14:19
Unknown
There's just pictures and plaques and team pictures and this is like this place is insane. Like the history here is crazy, you know? So it's kind of struck me then. But we also have a really cool organization in that, you know, starting with ICE Visor Man, who's big on development, big on we're going with and we're going to draft.

00:36:14:19 - 00:36:30:07
Unknown
Well, we're going to develop. We're going to we're it's a project, you know what I mean? And so it's really, really cool. To be involved on that, you know, on that part of it. Now, there's still tons of expectations, even though we're not a Top End team right now as far as winning and playing hard and playing while playing the right way.

00:36:30:17 - 00:36:54:09
Unknown
So there's pressure that way. But it's been it's been a really, really cool transition before. So I don't want to cut you off again, but I don't want no, it's okay. Do it again. You should be getting used to it by now. This is the second time now it's rolled back to relationship building and you're dealing with people and that's all I'm going to add for now because I think we lose that because you you could have made it like, hey, I'm doing blue.

00:36:54:09 - 00:37:17:18
Unknown
I played pro, I played NCAA, come to my campus, I'm going to make a boatload of money. But you started small built relationships, and then people just come all your jobs, you I can't remember. The first one was the student thing down for a sec. But one thing I'm I like one of the dads saying like, hey, hey, hey, Duane, you came a long way from your milk crate and your hot spot car.

00:37:18:07 - 00:37:34:23
Unknown
You know, like I used to show up at the rink with hot five crappy car and a milk crate with parks and pylons in it and like, run from ring to ring to ring to rank, you know? And that's what I was doing, man, for the first bunch and working off my coach and just sitting on my computer on an Excel sheet, put in times when I'm at the rink when I'm supposed to be there.

00:37:34:23 - 00:37:53:17
Unknown
That was my schedule, you know, and and I never imagined I'd own a gym and our whole development group in London and guys working for me and girls working for me and stuff. I never thought of that, but it just happened. And the other thing too, on the, on the coaches, we have like we have an unreal team of coaches like I lost this year.

00:37:54:12 - 00:38:11:19
Unknown
Our head strength coach left and went to Arizona with the Coyotes had strong coach in Arizona. And the guys and girls back in London have done an unbelievable job of just like keeping it going and running and doing a good job. And they're, they're awesome they're amazing. So I've been very, very fortunate to be around the right people.

00:38:11:19 - 00:38:27:10
Unknown
But to your point, it was never about like money or like I was just for like having fun getting good people around you and building a team and, and, you know, yeah, it's been it's worked out really, really well. You got so many different angles with that. I'm going to go though. I want to I'm kind of curious for the listeners.

00:38:27:10 - 00:38:42:01
Unknown
I'm curious again, because I know we spoke about it, but I want to hear a little bit more. What was the interview process once you got there? What like what do they have you do or if you can even share Yeah. So I, I knew the previous skills coach that was here and he ended up getting a job.

00:38:42:12 - 00:39:12:03
Unknown
Originally we were talking about, you know, doing some stuff together or whatever and then he ended up getting the job with Michigan. He wanted to get out of skills and more into coaching, so he wanted to become an assistant coach and he got the job at Michigan University, which is unbelievable. That's true of the school. Unreal. So then I end up getting a call from Sean Hawks, who played the NHL 4000 games, and he ended up calling me and saying, Hey, listen, we're looking at interviewing some guys for a school coach know, would you be interested in being part of the process?

00:39:12:03 - 00:39:36:11
Unknown
But yeah, for sure. Okay. So I had a couple conversations with him and said, Hey, would you be, would you be available and whatever data to child with Steve Eisenman. I am like, Yeah, for sure. So I get on a zoom call like this and all a sudden like seven screens pop up. Like when I joined the call, it's like Pompano Beach, like Cornwall, Eisenman, Cleary like Dan Cleary, Horror Convoy.

00:39:36:15 - 00:39:58:10
Unknown
Whoa. Like I thought was the only two people on this call. So the calls, like probably an hour, a lot of questions. What skill development my thoughts, my theories of what I do, how I do it, whatever was great. So then that was that. And then I got a call from work off another day or two, and my game is not really well like would you be able to talk to Jeff Marshall, the head coach in Detroit?

00:39:58:22 - 00:40:20:20
Unknown
I was like, Yeah, for sure. So it's that same thing. Zoom called him for like an hour to talk with kids hockey or whatever, and then a lot of like, what are your thoughts on this? How would you help create more offense? How would you that's like kind of like some pretty hardball questions, which were great. I thought that one well, and then in the process, it was originally it was like, you're going to be able to stay in London and travel back and forth.

00:40:20:21 - 00:40:37:23
Unknown
It's kind of my mind how I was thinking about it. Right. And then as we went on, then after that called, Marshall had a couple more calls to talk off. And then he said, listen, we, you know, we'd like you to move here potentially. So I got the call on our call and I knew the rules myself. And another guy in the running for the position.

00:40:37:23 - 00:40:54:16
Unknown
Right. I kind of heard through the grapevine. So I called for call back like 20 minutes later after that call, and I was like, Listen, am I the guy? Like, Am I the guy or am I in a race with this other guy? Because if I'm not the guy, that's totally fine. But if I'm the guy, I need to know because I got to make some stuff happen if I'm going to make this go.

00:40:55:06 - 00:41:14:08
Unknown
And I basically just want to know if I'm one or two, that's fine. If I'm one on one, then then this is a different conversation. And it's like, no, you're the guy I give the guy we want. So, you know, and then my conversation changed, but I wanted to be really forthcoming with them, really honest with them. Let me know if I'm the guy.

00:41:14:11 - 00:41:31:05
Unknown
If I'm not the guy, that's totally fine. But I need to know because, you know, if I am the guy that I'm really going to think about this basically, you know, so and then had a conversation happen. And then that's when kind of things progressed to Joanna. And I said, you know, let's do it and let's try it out and see how it goes.

00:41:31:24 - 00:41:51:03
Unknown
In the interview, promised, they said seven people popped up. So just I'm trying to think for other people for job interviews and we talk about like we can be and we talk with everyone. Everyone has a plan till they get punched in the face. So like you're sitting there getting ready for a call to people blown and then you seeing all these not just names like household names typically popping up on the screen.

00:41:51:13 - 00:42:11:00
Unknown
How did you handle that? How are you mentally strong enough to kind of get through that? Or you're just like, hey, I don't I'm not even going to pretend what you're thinking, but what's going through your head? I'll be honest. So I never met Steve Wiseman before. Right. And that's a zoom call. So I'm no officially, madam, but Steve Wiseman is a player that I grew up watching.

00:42:11:00 - 00:42:35:04
Unknown
And like just to captain a Stanley Cup champ, like a goat winner guy, like just a guy that you want to go to battle on the war with, you know, so even the fact that he was the GM in Detroit was attractive to me. The other thing I said to backtrack a little bit is if I ever got back in the NHL, I'd want to get back into a situation where, as in Washington, I was the only skilled around the coach for three or four years that I was there, which is great.

00:42:35:04 - 00:42:51:08
Unknown
I loved it, but I'd love to have a team. I'm a team guy. I am not I don't have an ego. I'm not trying to take your job. I wanna work together with people, you know? So I was I wanted to get on a team like I want to be part of like a bigger thing. Like more guys helping with development and having the age in order says short.

00:42:51:08 - 00:43:12:00
Unknown
Like, no, it totally makes sense, you know, or Hey, did you see this? And so in Detroit, they have a team, they have short walk off, they have Dan Cleary, they have got a Cornwall they've got a great team of people, right? So this is sick. So when Isaiah popped up, for instance, I was like, Oh, my God, that's actually in my mind, that's just looking at his living room right now.

00:43:12:00 - 00:43:34:23
Unknown
And which is really cool. And even like Cron was the guy I remember watch playing Dan Cleary for a couple of these guys. Verbeek like, I was like, oh my God, you know, we are the first like, you know, probably two or 3 minutes. I was like, oh, jeez, you know, I'm in one here. But I'm also like, there's nothing that I was going to prepare because everything about skill development.

00:43:34:23 - 00:43:52:12
Unknown
I know like, I know my head of what I like, what I love more. So the interview wasn't that hard because I wasn't faking anything. I was didn't have any made up answers. I was who I was I probably saw a couple of times in the interview on stuff I see there's things that piss me off with skill development or whatever, you know, but I was just who I was.

00:43:52:12 - 00:44:10:03
Unknown
And I think, you know, I think that's part of like even with Jeff Marshall and him. And I thought it was a great conversation and I was that it not delegates, but I hate this or hate that. Like just in certain things that is out there, you know what I mean? And I think that probably resonated with them a little bit that I'm just I am I am who I am.

00:44:10:03 - 00:44:26:06
Unknown
And then fast forward to today, like, I you know, I can I can text devise every now and be like, hey, I have a question about something. You know what I mean? Like, I see him almost every day or two days. He's around the rink all the time in our office all the time. He's in our teams. I'll go in there like we have boxes that we just like.

00:44:26:06 - 00:44:44:06
Unknown
Nothing crazy, but just there is we can sit up top and they're in management and 11 area. I sit with the goalie coach we I'll go in the management's booth or whatever box and travel them in intermission and hey, how's it going guys and stuff like that. And like they're awesome, like they're great and a day like all of us want the same thing.

00:44:44:06 - 00:45:04:11
Unknown
Like, I don't want an assistant coaching job. I don't want a GM job. Like, I want to help the players get better. Like Steve Eisman wants to win the Stanley Cup you know what I mean? Everyone's kind of pushing the same way. So it's a really, really cool environment that way where everyone's in their lane. You know, I haven't I haven't felt any anybody like looking over my shoulder, breathing over my shoulder, you know what I mean?

00:45:04:11 - 00:45:16:10
Unknown
I wouldn't care anyway. Like, as far as that's going to happen, it's going to happen. They don't like me. They want to bring this guy in. Fine. But it's been really cool that way. And everyone's you know, it's been a really, really good environment that way. So overall, it was a really, really cool process.

00:45:18:10 - 00:45:42:07
Unknown
I'm curious because the whole concept of having a skills coach is relatively new in sport, right? Like we grew up as kids. You did not exist your position did not know you got everything from the head coach doing. Can you dove into a little bit of I mean, your, you know, your age you started off playing hockey with us, your school, and now you're a professional skills coach.

00:45:42:14 - 00:46:09:10
Unknown
What was what's that evolution been like in sport? And it's not just hockey because I'm seeing it in football. I'm seeing it. You know, we everybody has a speed coach. Everybody has their own strength coach. Now, it's a very niche market. Can you talk to us a little bit about how you've seen that evolution take place? Yeah, so I think the biggest of the skills coaches, the best way to describe, I think a good skills coach is, you know, you look at a breakout, you look at a system, you look at a play in football, right?

00:46:09:19 - 00:46:28:22
Unknown
Coaches, look at that. Oh, man, we didn't execute this properly. The Rhodes wrong, right. A skills coach would be like when you went to catch that ball, your hands were too wide. You got to tighten or you know, I mean, you didn't turn your head quick enough. You didn't scan your options or whatever it is quarterback like you didn't look left you only you were you were tunnel vision on that one path.

00:46:28:22 - 00:46:47:04
Unknown
So same thing with hockey, with what we do now. The one thing with hockey is you've got defense, you got forwards. I don't touch. The goal is we have a goalie coach who works at the goalie specifically and some teams have a defense coach. Sometimes I have a four coach, you know what I mean? But for me, it's like a lot of it is interchangeable, especially the way the games play now jumping in and playing.

00:46:47:04 - 00:47:05:06
Unknown
And I understand the defense position in the off and the forwards position, but for me it's more like we can't break out. We're not doing a good job breaking out on this. Let's say one line is really struggling or one players really struggling on the boards. Well, his wall plays not good, so I'll work on his wall play or he's going down to take shots is getting shot opportunities.

00:47:05:06 - 00:47:20:13
Unknown
But they're always getting blocked. They're always getting tips, they're always getting knocked out. So how can we speed up a shot? How can we get him to set up his move earlier? So looking at those kind of things, you know, protecting pucks like those are high level things. But and then they're skating and there's puck handling and there's like little things like that.

00:47:20:13 - 00:47:36:10
Unknown
But yeah, those are things that were a skill coach would come into play, you know, want to be insulted, guys? Well, before practice, I'll work with them on certain little things and I'll take them off ice and work on stuff, or I'll send them video and be like, Hey, I'm looking at this from 200 feet above you. It's way easier for me to see this.

00:47:36:10 - 00:47:51:18
Unknown
But I just, you know, next time you're in this situation, you got all kinds of guys behind you. So rather than trying to shove it up the wall, you can cut back and now you can make a play with this. You know, and the guys appreciate that because I'm very honest about I'm like, I'm looking at this drinking a coffee at 200 feet above me.

00:47:52:09 - 00:48:08:15
Unknown
You're down and there's a £200 guy in front of you ready to take your head off like this is, you know, I get it, you know? So it's kind of cool in a way, though, because I used to be like, when my kids started going and I became a strength coach and a speed coach, and I'm like, this is kind of weird.

00:48:08:15 - 00:48:28:00
Unknown
It's not the way I grew up. But what I appreciate it now is as a head coach, it's one less thing I have to worry about. And I could specialize in something else, like the tactics where somebody like yourself is taking care of the technical part. And now I could think about who's house, how does he look and how's she doing?

00:48:28:12 - 00:48:51:00
Unknown
What do we need to do next? What sir? Our strategy and all that stuff. So it's kind of a nice we could specialize now and really focus on really more important stuff. So a shared knowledge, a short shared expertize. Right. Well, and that's a thing like as I get more comfortable and as they get more into the system and stuff like that, like my goal is to relieve stuff off the assistant coaches and the head coaches, if that makes sense.

00:48:51:00 - 00:49:09:24
Unknown
So like head coach, you calling me like so-and-so's shots? Terrible. I'm like, actually, I got five clips of them already sent to them. I've been working with them on this. Okay, great. Cause I see it. Do you know what I mean? Or some will come up in conversation that the coaches are talking about. And then I think the crazy thing with my job is like, I'm with the coaches day to day.

00:49:10:00 - 00:49:27:06
Unknown
So I'm like sitting at the table going through practice. I'm watching video on like Ozone. I'm in the power play meetings, I'm in the PTA meeting. So I'm hearing their language, I'm hearing their verbiage, I'm hearing what they're saying. So when I talk to a player, I'll be like, Hey, your wall bump isn't good. You know, no one no one knows what that means, but they do, and I do.

00:49:27:06 - 00:49:41:06
Unknown
And the coaches do, you know what I mean? So I can use that same language. And that's a nice thing. When I said this, when I took the job and I was going to travel back and forth, potentially, I told you on this team, like, I think if you're going to do it right at the NHL level and you want a real good skills coach, you bring you're there day to day.

00:49:41:16 - 00:49:58:24
Unknown
Yeah. You get to know the players. You're having your you're around them. You're on the ice parachuting in. Yeah. Because when you parachute in, it's awesome. It's fun. But you're, you're taking ten, 15, 20 minutes to build that relationship where now every morning I'm like, Hey, what's going on, buddy? Hey, how are you doing, man? Hey, I was a day off yesterday.

00:49:58:24 - 00:50:15:06
Unknown
Like, it's already there where we saw each other yesterday or the day before, and I. So you're not wasting time getting, you know, getting back in, like, you know, meeting up again for the first ten, 15 minutes, you know what I mean? Like, so you're just it's just normal, right? So it's it's been really, really cool. So I. Go ahead.

00:50:15:07 - 00:50:33:20
Unknown
Gee, I remember too many times already. No, no, we get no, it's good questions or good I remember first starting off the business in Dwayne Ketchum marks it. Well, we've all we're all in business. I guess I just realizing that now. But I remember coach and the team is starting the business like had to be the pitching guy, the catching guy, the hitting guy, the infield guy, the outfield guy.

00:50:34:14 - 00:50:51:07
Unknown
Because I'm just thinking about your role specifically now. That's got to be unreal for that part because like you're saying now, if you can have a guy who's just going to take care of that position and then that position. And then I remember at one point as a coach kind of looking at things, I was coaching everything, make sure you hit your cut off, make sure you're doing this, make sure you're doing that.

00:50:51:18 - 00:51:10:19
Unknown
And then I remember because we had played like seven games when the finals of the tournament, and I finally got to step back and manage a game rather than coach again. Right? Because coaching is like the X's and O's, this, that than the other. But when you get to manage the game, you're like thinking three plays ahead. Or for me in baseball, I'm thinking like, Okay, who's coming up in this situation in that part of the game?

00:51:10:19 - 00:51:25:13
Unknown
Of the game stays this, you know this, the score is this and who we're going to put running for that situation. But when you're having to do everything so I used to look at it like a sign of weakness as a coach. I used to look at that as a sign of weakness. Why would I have, you know, why would this guy be in charge of this?

00:51:25:13 - 00:51:42:06
Unknown
I I'm the coach, man. I should be able to do this and I should be able to do that because then I'm thinking I'm like at the NHL level or at the pro level, like they have guys like you coming in. I wonder at the beginning for a coach if it was it hurt their ego in the sense of like, I know how to do all this stuff, what the hell's this guy doing here?

00:51:42:14 - 00:52:01:17
Unknown
And then now like for me, seeing those people coming in, it's just a breath of fresh air because then I can really manage instead of coach just know. I think that's a really good point, and I think really good coaches I think are really good leaders. I have a really strong and some of their convictions and some of the things they want, but I think their ego is in check a little bit.

00:52:02:08 - 00:52:29:05
Unknown
They be the power play to the one coach in the penalty kill to another coach. They oversee it, they talk about it, they leave the skills to another coach, they oversee it, they talk about it, but they let that guy do their thing. And the other thing, too, is a lot of there's a lot of phonies out there right so there's a lot of like, you know, if I if I had a skills coach come up to my kids practice and I've had this before where I've had school coaches come on to my practice and I was helping out with a team and they're junk.

00:52:29:11 - 00:52:45:19
Unknown
It's terrible. So like, yeah, I get off the ice, like I've been set up and like, you know, I just it's like I've never hired a guy or that girl. Like, it's brutal. That's how I got roped into coaching soccer. I'm like, I know nothing about soccer, but I will do a hell of a better job than this schmuck of resentment.

00:52:45:19 - 00:53:00:18
Unknown
And that's been it. Give me your cones and your whistles and get the hell low. And this is the one thing with skill coaching. There are a lot of people are, you know, are probably thinking is they're going to go to Instagram, they're going to watch a guy for a pocket or top of his legs. Bounce it here, bounce it there, knock it in.

00:53:00:18 - 00:53:16:00
Unknown
Like, how many times have you seen that happen in a guy? And like, great skill. It's amazing. Even though even the Michigan are like scooping up behind the net and talking to an unbelievable play. Like great. There's been four of them in the NHL in the last three or four years. Like, it's an unreal goal. Don't get me wrong.

00:53:16:00 - 00:53:37:00
Unknown
But yeah, there's four of them and one guy did it twice. I don't I mean and Zegras has done it twice. One foot over one. He talked about like this happen to you. It doesn't happen doesn't times like that's 56 players have done that and there's 700 players in the league in a probably like a multimillion opportunities to make that happen.

00:53:37:03 - 00:53:59:18
Unknown
Right. It's like winning the lottery said yes it is it's the the the small details of like you say the bump off the boards those are little things that make you a pro and keep you a pro. Exactly. And so I think there's a lot of phonies out there and if they don't regardless if they have 3 million followers on on Instagram or YouTube or whatever, doesn't matter.

00:53:59:22 - 00:54:18:02
Unknown
So I think that day it's like for me, if I if I, I had to connect with the coaching staff I do. You know what I mean? There was a lot of relationships to be built there that they trust what I do and I work with like Alex Tang, who's played, I think a thousand games. And and Charlie is you know, he's scored a ton of points and he's in and these are one of our assistant coaches.

00:54:18:20 - 00:54:31:05
Unknown
He's amazing. So him and I chat all the time. He'll have drills we got. That's great. If he comes in and he has a drill and I was about to do a drill, I'm like, Oh, it's cool. I'll jump in like a hobo with it. Like, I don't have an ego on that. I'm like, That's cool. Let's do that.

00:54:31:05 - 00:54:51:00
Unknown
You know what I'm saying? The coach who does it all the good is played many years. He's coached for almost 18 years. NHL, like he's been around a long time, like, yeah, let's work together, man. So like and I was very clear with both of them at different opportunities where I was like, I don't want to be in this is a coach in injury to the guy not here to further my career to become an assistant coach.

00:54:51:00 - 00:55:10:13
Unknown
I'm here to be a skills coach. I like mentally and I love what I do on all because you guys like it's pretty cool. It was a person, so it's been good. It's been great. Like overall it's been awesome. Like we've all worked well together so far. So and it's funny you said that because I'm obviously I'm not a hockey specialist and I love being a head coach in hockey because I love like J.G. The managing and stuff like that.

00:55:10:13 - 00:55:26:16
Unknown
And I love coaching. But the, you know, I sent my own kid to the technical specialist and she's had a handful. And the interesting part is her favorite ones were the ones that she enjoyed. They were not donkeys, they weren't jerks, and they didn't have the big ego like, look at me, I played here and I did this.

00:55:27:02 - 00:55:45:11
Unknown
It was, Okay, let's make you better. And it was about you, not them. And I think those were the ones that cause she had some they had amazing pedigrees, like this one guy had an amazing hockey pedigree, and we were driving to Mississauga to see him, but she was like, I don't want to come back here. I'm like, Okay, know, what did you say?

00:55:46:12 - 00:56:00:08
Unknown
If we have to cut this later, we can cut this later. But what did you say to me? Like, if somebody has a really good example, a resume, like parents, typically I'll give that person you got maybe two or three shots until they really find out who you are and then kind of things wash themselves out. Would remember that conversation.

00:56:00:16 - 00:56:23:17
Unknown
Yeah, I think honestly, like even to your point, Mark, like, you know, you bring your daughter, I always tell parents like your kids, you're measuring stick man and you as a parent how to be a conscious consumer because if you to throw money at garbage that's on you like that's on you. So like if you're out there watching your kid and and and the skills coaches taking more time videoing your kid for Instagram than he is working with your kid or she has work with your kid red flag yeah.

00:56:23:19 - 00:56:47:16
Unknown
If they're not getting corrected through drills, they're just running through a bunch of drills like red flag, you know, so you've gone through all this and multiple sports. So I think if your daughter comes home or your son comes home or in the car, like I told, any time I have a hiring kid, let's say your daughter daughter's playing D1 and I was working with her in Junior and I'd say, Listen, we only do one session and after the session, you know, I'd talk to you guys on the car ride home.

00:56:47:16 - 00:56:59:14
Unknown
You guys talk about it, you guys want to do another one? Let me know. Let me know. And the final words and all, like no hard feelings like it's totally cool because I'm not going to connect with everybody, you know? And I think that's like the one thing that's helped me along the way was like, there's no commitment here.

00:56:59:14 - 00:57:15:02
Unknown
You want to buy a ten pack, not by five pack. It's like this is an investment, especially as you get into like that. Even at ten, 11, 1230, you want to do private lessons or small lessons. It cost a lot of money. So let's do one session say, like this year you like. What I do is you like what I'm teaching your kid, you know?

00:57:15:12 - 00:57:34:22
Unknown
And I think that's a big thing. Like, the kids are good measuring stick. But also parents got to watch because some of these guys and girls are they're exactly, you know, two or three sessions anyway. Like we're doing the same session again today that we did three days ago. It's identical. Pretty much like what do we why are we doing two on ones and all my kids be better at shooting apocalypse?

00:57:34:22 - 00:57:54:18
Unknown
Why are we what are we doing right now? So I don't think we need to back it up to and say, does your kid even want to do that first? And I say like, yeah, great. You find a great coach, but is your kid willing to go and do that? As like one day is like my kids. Like, I think they want to go work on, you know, edges or whatever.

00:57:55:03 - 00:58:10:17
Unknown
But it was just some of those things that we as parents would be like, you need to do this, you need to do that. And then all of a sudden now we start to kind of create that that that wet blanket, that pressure that might take away the love of the game for the kid. Right. Well, and I think that's a big thing.

00:58:10:17 - 00:58:31:07
Unknown
Like any sport, it is, right? Like I remember from year to year, probably the same. Probably the same. Like my parents ever told me to go shoe box. My parents never told me about the outer ring. My parents never told me to go for a jog like I did all that stuff on my own. And I'm going through it now with my with my young guy who's nine and I was like, I was only stick with you got your version poxy because you wanted me to buy you.

00:58:31:07 - 00:58:51:09
Unknown
You stick, you got to practice you parks, you know, and my wife comes over to me. She's like playing like she's on rollerblades every day. She's outside playing, like, hockey every day. And I'm like, yeah, you're right. You're right, you don't. And I get off your wallet and get your kids. You work, you work for franchised, you know, you walk out the door with me, and I'm sorry.

00:58:51:22 - 00:59:14:16
Unknown
Nobody saw some of those things were like she was right, obviously. But like, you know, he likes the rain. I'll see what happens on the road. But like, if your kid's doing those things and they're unprompted, they're just going out and doing it. Like, then for me, I'm like, open doors, man. Help open doors. Because, you know, who knows what happens maybe they just play high level Double-A hockey or high level football in their high school, which is amazing.

00:59:14:16 - 00:59:35:11
Unknown
Like, that's awesome. Just being building skills as a person. Exactly. Yeah. For sure. I remember I share this story in a previous episode, but I remember when we had anatomy. You're my class. I'm almost positive we're at anatomy. We had this book as a as a teacher and we had this project and it was like you had to do 50 pictures or 100 pictures of injuries or people are I camera what it was.

00:59:35:24 - 00:59:49:06
Unknown
And I had taken all the Sports Illustrated's and kind of like whoever number one was and two is like Derek Jeter like to show like this is the number one actual size number two all the way through. And I remember getting to like later and I'm just like, what the hell am I doing? I don't even like this stuff.

00:59:49:11 - 01:00:05:02
Unknown
And I was just at the point that when you find somebody and you're just so involved in it and like my parents then said he did a really you have to do a really good job in this project if you want to your credit. I just wanted to just wanted to do it right. And it's like you want it to be like to work, to be proud of you.

01:00:05:02 - 01:00:19:23
Unknown
Like, Hey, man, you did frickin good job here. But it just becomes internal. And if you're just given the right, I guess like you're saying, the right opportunities and you get the right stage to be able to do it, but it's just to keep given those opportunities to be able to successful, I guess, at the same time. Totally.

01:00:20:02 - 01:00:43:17
Unknown
Yeah, no, for sure. And I think for parents to like surrounding your kids, great people, you know, especially as they get high end right? Yeah. Whether it's a coach, whether it's a teacher, whether it's a strength coach, skills coach or mental coach, whatever that is, like starts drowning and, you know, I joke with this all the time. Like if any guys I worked with signed a draft in the first round, the NHL, like I didn't get anything for that.

01:00:44:01 - 01:00:59:20
Unknown
I didn't get a bonus for that. I don't give a shit but I love it. Like, good for you. And I'm proud of them, you know? And for me, like, that was my enjoyment of, of work. A lot of these guys and still now like, you know, I'm not going to get a bonus if so-and-so scores 20 goals this year, you know what I mean?

01:00:59:20 - 01:01:18:12
Unknown
And then I will look at the album. It's a good man. It's awesome. It's great the good for you, you know, so I it just yeah, it's to your point, you do. It's like, you know, you get motivated by working with these athletes, you know what I mean? And you try to like as a coach, you try to inspire them a little bit and try to get them to be better and try to get them to find that inspiration within them.

01:01:18:12 - 01:01:35:09
Unknown
You know, we we tell our families, your kid and you are the average of the five people you hang out with the most at the end of the day, you can't hang out with dusters. No, you can. Dusters aren't good. Mark, what do you call them? Shoe boxes you put on the top shelf and you forget about it.

01:01:35:09 - 01:02:02:01
Unknown
They climb inside the garage. I don't even see Jimmy's house. Anyway, so, Dwane, you talked about this at Detroit, but you also talked about this, that total package, total player hockey, something like that. But you talk, but surround yourself with good people. What did it take or what's it take to get finally to that part like you said, sitting there in front of Excel spreadsheets where I need to be, it was just like craziness, organized, controlled chaos, I would call it.

01:02:02:12 - 01:02:17:09
Unknown
But then finally you got like you know, maybe somebody to help you out and then somebody else. And next thing you're you're leasing a place and it just kind of it grows organically. But I'm sure you had some duds at the same time, but like how do you get to the point to surround like I know we all want to surround ourselves with good people.

01:02:17:09 - 01:02:43:10
Unknown
What's that take? What's that look like? I think part of it is, is being patient a little bit and not like just jumping in right away. The first person that comes knocking on your door like you're going to stick in a pocket and skates. I want to work for you. And because that happens, but just being patient a little bit on it and you know, and then getting to know people, you know, and really trying to find out they're kind of true and the aisles in the room, what do you want like you want to make money doing hockey.

01:02:43:10 - 01:03:02:15
Unknown
You want to coach kids. You want to like finding out what their motivation is to think that was a big piece of it as well. And also to not be afraid to like work. You know, like I've gone through many I've gone through two times now where I've had like my second guy, like my best guy leave and I'm like, oh, man, I'm all I mean, I'm on the ice.

01:03:02:15 - 01:03:22:16
Unknown
What? I mean, I'm traveling all the more. I'm in some and I do it, you know, and then we're okay. We're all we've been okay. And then happened again. We were okay, you know, and so I think that's the biggest thing about not being afraid to work. And then also just trying to, like, be patient and get to know people don't rush in relationships just like you would if your daughter comes home and says Hey, I met a guy two months ago, I'm going to be married.

01:03:22:16 - 01:03:43:08
Unknown
Like, No, you're not. No, you're not. And there's no way I'm getting married life. You're in the basement of locking it out, you know what I mean? Like, I mean, that would be a long conversation, right? So I just think that, like, just, you know, just be patient with it a little bit. And then, you know, and then try to find the right people, obviously, which takes time.

01:03:43:08 - 01:04:02:00
Unknown
You know, I know a guy that's kind of the situations you're talking about right now, but how is it because you said, you know, I'm not going to have to take on more like Marc. You've lived this. Duane. I want to get your input on it. It's the conversation with your your wife, right? Like with generally as soon as that happens, I'm making an assumption here.

01:04:02:00 - 01:04:18:21
Unknown
As soon as that happens, like, hey, man, I was on the ice for 40 hours. I had to put in 65 hours now, and that's going to be less time for this and she's going to have to go here, do this, and I'm going to miss this with the kids. Now, how did you deal with that? And like, I know you've guys gotten stronger obviously with it, but how do you how do you watch old man?

01:04:18:21 - 01:04:35:04
Unknown
I told like, but I was really honest. My wife when we first started dating and stuff, and I said, like, this is kind of what I do and it's going to be weird hours. I like to work when the kids out of school. So I work opposite of my buddy Doug and Mark and I. We're all going to work from 4:00 till 9:00 some nights or whatever.

01:04:35:04 - 01:04:51:02
Unknown
And my whole goal is to get away from that eventually and hire good people that can help, you know, help me out with that. And then I could be home and especially ones that are family and things like that, you know? So and my wife's been unbelievable the whole time. Now, there's obviously concessions like I got to, you know, if I'm, hey, we're going to go away this weekend.

01:04:51:02 - 01:05:04:23
Unknown
Like, I really try to make that happen or I want to have at least one or two nights at home or I'm going to be home for that night, you know, and then coming to Detroit, even now, we're almost back to like because we are a game. Like, we have a game tomorrow night. I'm going to be on leave.

01:05:04:23 - 01:05:19:06
Unknown
Like, I probably won't see my kids in the morning. I'll leave at six 37 and I may stay at the rink all day and then I won't get home till 12:00 at night. So we'll see them and then I'll go to the rink the next morning at 6:00 in the morning, 7:00 in the morning, and then I'll pick them up from school and that sucks.

01:05:19:06 - 01:05:39:04
Unknown
Like for as a dad that sucks, don't get me wrong, but it's my wife that sucks too, you know what I mean? Like so but it's those conversations jeez. It's explaining to her like she's super supportive, which has been great. And it's also like my wife and I also have like goals and visions long term. Like, as far as just an ordinary little money, just like we want to try it.

01:05:39:04 - 01:06:03:22
Unknown
We want to, we want to retire young one day. We want to go and travel, want to do our thing like we enjoy each other. We enjoy spending time with each other and stuff. So it's I'm not saying we have the perfect marriage right now, but what I'm getting out is like, it's having those conversations and communicating. We're turning into a couples, you know, but it's like, is it because I'll tell you what, Matt, I hired a guy at one point, and I and I said, listen, before I hire you full time, I want to sit down with you and your wife and I went to their house and I met with him and his wife

01:06:03:22 - 01:06:21:02
Unknown
We sat down with coffee table coffee and told wife, I'm like, listen to what? Because sometimes husbands tend to sugarcoat things, really. But I was like, listen, I want you to know, like, this job sucks, you know? And I leave it over. I'm like, there's room. We might work five days a week from like 4:00, 10:00, and then we got to be in the morning.

01:06:21:02 - 01:06:37:15
Unknown
So early morning sessions. Like, I just wanted her to know and hear from me that this was not going to be. So when she's pissed off and she's mad at him and he's suing me and she's like, I I told you that this is exactly what it's going to be like, you know? And it worked out great. We were together for ten years.

01:06:37:15 - 01:06:57:05
Unknown
We were together. It was awesome. She was great and he was awesome. But it was just like it's having those tough conversations which are not ideal, you know? And if, you know, they hope your wife knows that, you know, you're not just like hanging out your buddies and playing cards. You're like, you're building something you're trying to like there is a light at the end of the tunnel, you know what I mean?

01:06:57:06 - 01:07:16:11
Unknown
And I think that's the biggest thing that, you know, I try to communicate with my wife make sure she's on board. Like if she was a hard squash in, then I probably would, you know, probably make different decisions, you know what I mean? Or what type of conversations you know. Yeah, so sorry. So for the rink, like the games at seven, you don't show up like at five.

01:07:16:13 - 01:07:38:10
Unknown
That's not how it works. They are. No. Well, you know what? Like sometimes I'll come home the like, so we'll go in in the mornings of pre-game skate. Right. And if there's any guys'll skate those guys. So I'll be there on the eighth. Let's see. We get in kind of early at like seven. Go through practice whatever we're going to do that day and then, and then I'll skate guys before pregame and I'll go on the pre-game skate at like 1030 with the coaching staff and do that.

01:07:38:11 - 01:07:58:20
Unknown
Then I'll stay on with guys after pregame skate nets around them and like work on shooting whatever it is. And then by that time it's like 1130 12 usually by the time or kind of wrapped up and done everything. So I could shoot home sometimes with stuff going on at the rink, the meeting or whatever, you know, and then but then I got to come back and usually back by four or five for the game.

01:07:58:20 - 01:08:16:07
Unknown
You know what I mean? Some like awesome days, I'll just stay here and you know some of those I'll at home, but to be out depends on the day that sometimes people wrap around their brains. Like it's not just like a show and go like there's a lot that is going to the process. It looks pretty when you turn on your TV, when it's convenient, you crack open your beer and you're watching the game.

01:08:16:07 - 01:08:39:06
Unknown
But you know who just never stops. It's crazy. Like, so I don't travel with the team. Like when the team goes away and goes to Philadelphia or goes down on wherever, I'll I stay back. I'll work with enterprises to here, or I'll go to Grand Rapids, which is our age. All teams on their like whatever it is, depending on the month, maybe six times a month, three times a month, I'll go in for a day or two days it's 2 hours away so I can leave.

01:08:39:06 - 01:09:05:00
Unknown
I get up at four 35 in the morning, go to Grand Rapids and all the coaches in the morning ski with the guys to like 1231 and then I'll shoot back. I could pick the kids up at school, so it's not bad. It's a day trip. It's like over a day. But the coaches in the NHL, like for anyone listening who doesn't like, you know, they're at the rink usually by seven, seven 30, almost daily, one day off a week usually like a mandatory the off week for the players but that's not the coach's like.

01:09:05:06 - 01:09:20:20
Unknown
So every time we play they're starting a preschool for the next game you know what I mean they're starting to get ready for the next game right so they're looking at the clips from last game. They're preschool for the next game and the schedule is really intense at the NHL level. And I think football and basketball and stuff is the same.

01:09:20:20 - 01:09:44:18
Unknown
I don't think it's much different, but at the NHL level, at the pro level, it's a lot and there's a lot of travel, a lot of video, a lot of it's it's it's intense for sure. Awesome. You know, it's interesting going back to family and seeing it. It's a foundational element to allowing people like ourselves to do what we do and do the extra stuff and enjoy it.

01:09:45:07 - 01:10:15:02
Unknown
And that was I always ask our guests, especially if their parents, do you parent the same way you coach or coach the same way you parent Oh, it's interesting. I think I think I'm pretty level one. I got you know, I have a hard time watching my kids sometimes. Like, I don't know, externally, but internally because I've met all man, that character all ages, like whether it's soccer league, oh, my God, you could dominate this game or you could, you know, so I have a hard time with that.

01:10:15:02 - 01:10:30:20
Unknown
I really try to play awesome. I have I was very, very fortunate. I had a dad who was super positive, never got on me about anything. I was way harder. I think he knew I was way harder myself than anybody. So he never I could play the worst game in the world and get in the car and play.

01:10:30:20 - 01:10:47:04
Unknown
All right. You only skin Arnold through my dad. I suck tonight like I and we'd have that conversation, but he's always positive. So I was really fortunate. I'm not quite like that. Like I'm a little bit more like I want to talk about a little bit, but I also I've also had both my kids this. And I said, when dad's on the eighth, I go to practice.

01:10:47:17 - 01:11:03:06
Unknown
I'm like, do you guys feel like you're my dad, you're my son? Or do you feel like like you're one of the players and and both my son was like, no, I feel like I'm one of the players. We go, he gets I really try to treat them like one of the players. Even on the bench, one coaching, I'm like, they're one of the players and not harder on them.

01:11:03:06 - 01:11:23:10
Unknown
I probably maybe talk to them or they're lying. More like, you know, just now they're I'm thinking about it. Probably give them more advice, you know, I give all the ones advice. But you know what I mean? I really want I want my kid to be good. Like, let's be honest, we all be right. Yeah. But I don't I don't heart I'm not hard on my kid and my kid from the reason I don't yell at them and yeah.

01:11:23:11 - 01:11:39:24
Unknown
And I don't play them more like I don't get much rights because my kid, you know, so I try to be as level as I can and with all the kids, like, I'm like my kid. For instance, we play on a team right now. It's a bunch of nine year olds, eight, nine year olds. And I think my kid's one of two kids that might get stressed on his own time zone skates and everything.

01:11:40:12 - 01:11:55:01
Unknown
And that was something like from the time they were six years old, like, you're getting undressed on your own, I'll help you get dressed or you're going to undress them, and then they get dressed on their own and then I want you tighter skates, you know? And my daughters started tighter on skates now, too. And it's not like but it's just like that's an independent thing.

01:11:55:03 - 01:12:09:14
Unknown
It's like you go do your thing, you get dressed, you do your thing. And so I'm trying as much as I can to make them as independent as they can. You know, he wants to play he's playing right now. He wants to play for like as a coach, like, I'm just assistant coach. I can't be around all the time like the coach.

01:12:10:00 - 01:12:25:11
Unknown
So he goes and ask coach, like, you know what I mean? So that's on you like. So I'm trying to for me, it's not about them being good players. For them being good people and learning how to talk to authority, learning how to deal with conflict, all that stuff, you know? So that's my big thing with them right now.

01:12:25:11 - 01:12:41:14
Unknown
And I think they're young. I don't think anyone's going to make the NHL at nine years old or ten years old. So I really don't care about that. You know, I just think let's make them good kids and not just hand other kids into let's make them good kids, good people, good teammates, and then hopefully things, you know, work well for them.

01:12:41:14 - 01:13:01:17
Unknown
You know, I'd read that or seen that somewhere where they typically say people raise their kids either for their kids to be independent or to be able to still take care of them when they're older. And it sounds like I'm making an assumption here. I think we've had our parents kind of like get the hell out of a cat, out of the house, fend for yourself.

01:13:01:17 - 01:13:33:01
Unknown
But I talked to Mark about this morning. I don't know how it's going to go, this conversation, but three of us lost our dads when I think is at a young age. Is that fair to say, Dwayne, for you, Marcus? Sure. Yeah. Yeah. So how how has that been like I'm throwing that even to you, Mark, like not just for Dwayne for the six months off while doing your you know, your story about your dad being positive and I remember playing with a guy and his dad was not positive.

01:13:33:14 - 01:13:52:09
Unknown
And this is going to be tough to get through. But I think we were maybe 12, 11, 12 years old. And if you didn't have a good game, he'd make his kid run home. But my dad knew that, so he'd say, to me, we're waiting here. We're going to let the old man leave and we're going to pick up the kid and drive them home.

01:13:52:21 - 01:14:10:08
Unknown
Yeah, you know, to, to me, to just anyone. Back then, as a kid, I didn't really think anything about it, but your story just made me think about that. Like, the thing was, I was learning compassion from my dad at a young age, and it's just like it wasn't about sports. It was about people. Yeah, these men doing this podcast and telling these stories.

01:14:10:08 - 01:14:25:05
Unknown
And, you know, you and I talked about a lot of this is founded in our families and stuff like that. And you're realizing now that, like, my mom used to throw me batting practice in the backyard with, like, little peas. She wear like goggles, and she's like, You want to swing the bat? I'll throw you some piece of shit.

01:14:25:15 - 01:14:45:19
Unknown
No, no, it's true. We'd have a little mailing in the grass in the summertime, but, you know, they were there, and they're always there for other people's kids. And stuff like that. My dad would be on the drive people, and we're going to do that. But, you know, it's yeah, it's yeah, it's tough, man. Totally. How old are you?

01:14:45:20 - 01:15:12:01
Unknown
You lost your dad. Oh, God. It's been a while now, I think. Now it's been 14 years, so I wasn't, there wasn't my mid thirties. Early thirties. Yeah. So it's too soon. Yeah. Oh, definitely, man. Definitely. How old are you, Gigi? Same thing, I think. My late, uh, early, late twenties. Early thirties. Yeah. And, like, you think right at the time, you think of parents like I don't know, you think it's all.

01:15:12:01 - 01:15:35:11
Unknown
But now that you're getting older. Holy shit. Those are so young. It's crazy. And I always say, like, I'm finding lessons now as I'm getting older from my dad thinking, you know, when I remember when he passed, it was like, did I get all the lessons I needed? My dad was a quiet guy, but he was a lead by example guy and all that stuff.

01:15:35:11 - 01:15:56:06
Unknown
So to me, and like, that is the lessons we're taught, like early and it just it's a continuation rate. So it's very fortunate that way. Both parents are super supportive. No, definitely doing was same thing. You know, they throw me out there no. I was 19 when I was. Oh, sorry. So my dad, it's a crazy story. My dad was like, so when I played Junior, I played Junior.

01:15:56:15 - 01:16:24:00
Unknown
So I love somebody to Mark. I'm playing Junior, Marco, we play a game on a Saturday and let's say, you know, my dad would randomly didn't know come to the game. I drive from Sudbury to, to Markham. I could hear him yelling. He always yelled, let's go blue. And I got out. My dad's there after the game. We done that you know, nine 30, 10:00 as the junior game would be fans like it was it was a pretty good setup to go out.

01:16:24:11 - 01:16:42:02
Unknown
Hey Dad, I was going to the show in the parking lot of beers, right? I'm heading back go back surgery. They come down for a game and I'm like, that's like you did that numerous times, you know, just Road Warrior. He is a salesman. You travel a lot. No problem driving through, not for hours, watching them fight the drive back like so.

01:16:42:12 - 01:17:01:18
Unknown
And he was a guy like if you was at my games or whatever, I'd call him after. Like I remember being at the bar like just a pub and we go to after the game, get wings and beers, whatever, and down on the pay phone, like for the quarter end or whatever it was called, collect. And I like anybody who's game because back then you don't have you know, you don't have games on broadcast like that.

01:17:01:18 - 01:17:19:10
Unknown
You had no idea. Right now we can't get you only 13 to eight a goal that I know whatever all get on the play and then I love you. I love you. Bye. You know, it's like he was our guy, right? So I got a scholarship to Alabama. He my mom and my dad. So my mom, my dad, my sister drove me down to Alabama, drop me off state.

01:17:19:10 - 01:17:41:03
Unknown
A couple of days later, I was settled and then drove back. So we and we were like, so we charged maybe that week once. And then that weekend, Sunday, my dad called me, think it was like, hey, sorry. This your freshman year? My first year there. Yeah. So my dad calls me. He's like, hey, I don't think I'll ever fulfill starting now, but it's like, hey, how's everything going ever?

01:17:41:04 - 01:17:55:15
Unknown
Good, good. Everything's fine. And he's a guy. I'm not feeling back really like it. Kind of under the weather. A little bit of my going away is a guy I'm going to see Grandma. Grandpa, that was his mom and dad. They're really close. They live not too far away. So I'm like, okay, my dad, I don't know what your dad's like.

01:17:55:15 - 01:18:17:12
Unknown
Never really got some kind of role. Never really went to my dog at six. So anyways, but then on it, yeah, basically I yeah. So he goes to my grandma and grandpa whatever and that's fine. And then the next day, so Monday, whatever it was morning after, I can't remember, my mom calls me and my mom's like Duane does the hospital like just talk to me yesterday.

01:18:17:19 - 01:18:35:15
Unknown
And my mom was out of town. Mom was in Montreal visiting her great grandma, her grandmother and stuff with my little sister. So they came back all my dad had a seizure at my grandparents place. She had something called encephalitis, which is like a swelling in the brain. And it could be caused by like a mosquito. It could have been.

01:18:35:15 - 01:18:54:14
Unknown
Cause in Alabama, no one really knows what happened. But long story short, he ended up, like, basically losing like all like when I was the first conversation I had with him, it was like something along the lines and like, he narrows it going, man, he's like, oh, good. I was just I don't know, we were fixing the car and like, just like talking to, like, a crazy person, you know, like, no, idea.

01:18:54:20 - 01:19:14:06
Unknown
So he lost all his long term memory. All short term memory. And it was basically, you know, they're like, he's probably will never function in society again. Well, a couple of years, you know, a year later, he's basically driving again. He's living like he's on his own, like, but he's like a long lost uncle. Like, he never, you know, he wouldn't remember where I was.

01:19:14:06 - 01:19:28:17
Unknown
He knew who I was with, didn't know where I was or where I played or what I was doing at that point or whatever, you know. So when we went like that for 20 years, man, and stuff like that, and then at the end he got cancer and got really sick and then passed, which is probably honestly like the best thing by the end it was.

01:19:30:00 - 01:19:57:11
Unknown
But yeah, it was like, that was the toughest part is, you know, we went from 19 years old, like one of my best buddies as far as a dad father thing or whatever, and then losing that, you know, and that's like you guys still you don't, you wish you'd be here to see the grandkids and hang oh come over for you know we watch the kids play sports and you know your dad same thing they would have been the biggest cheerleaders and would have been so pumped about it you know so yeah yeah it's just, you know what I and I never saw one of my dad got sick.

01:19:57:11 - 01:20:13:05
Unknown
I went back I was at school, obviously. And when I was at school, my mom my dad was self-employed. My mom was self-employed. And then almost a little restaurant. I knew the restaurant wasn't going well. I was all these kids. So I knew like, you know, I knew the financial not not in depth, but I knew wasn't great.

01:20:13:14 - 01:20:28:02
Unknown
And my dad was doing well in real estate and whatever smells and that's zero. So I told my mom, I'm like, I'm going to come home and hockey sock. Like, I was playing every second game. I was a freshman I was a rookie. Like, it was brutal. I'm like, I'm coming home. She's like, no, you're not coming home, John.

01:20:28:03 - 01:20:41:23
Unknown
You're not. There's nothing you can do here. Because my brother was there. My sister were there in Sudbury. I'm like, I'll come home, I'll work, I'll help out, and I can come back here next year. So no, you're not going. She would not let me leave. And good things she didn't like that was like the worst year, you know?

01:20:42:06 - 01:20:56:08
Unknown
But I didn't talk to anybody about it and talk to anybody. Like my buddies on the team didn't know. Nobody knew. The next year I got back to school. One of my buddies had found out through the grapevine that my dad was sick and the good buddy mine, he came to me and it's like he's passed away. Why do you tell me this?

01:20:56:08 - 01:21:14:13
Unknown
Like, and then we started talking about it. And when I started talking about it, it just like it was like a huge weight lifted off my shoulders, man. And I started talking a little bit like I wasn't spreading the gospel or just talking to people about it more. And I was like, I was bottling up so much man, and it was so bad for me, and I didn't realize it.

01:21:14:21 - 01:21:49:16
Unknown
And then from that point on, it was just like it was it just got so much easier to communicate about things that are a little bit deeper then. And once you start talking about it, you realize that everyone's got a story. You know, that's my story. And people are we were stories about, you know, and, and but everybody's got a story of something that's, you know, that's, you know, you just got to realize that, you know, I try to tell the athletes that I coach at least once a year and because I know my my dad passing and not having a chance to see his granddaughters flourish like they were young, like six and eight, I

01:21:49:16 - 01:22:08:23
Unknown
think when. Yeah, when he passed away, I tell the the adult kids that adults, they're 18, 14, 15. I say, you know, look in the bleachers right now. Your parents and your grandparents be grateful that they've given you the opportunity to do this. I do it for every sport and you some because we take it for granted, right?

01:22:08:23 - 01:22:35:18
Unknown
We get into the routine mom and dad are going to drive me. We're all going well. And then all of a sudden, like your case, you just one day he was fine and the next day he wasn't. So this is a reminder for everybody to be grateful and, you know, share that gratitude. And like guys like we've had plenty of people open up on this show about that because family's so important to making the you function as a professional, as a as a dad.

01:22:36:02 - 01:22:53:13
Unknown
And, you know, I never want to take anybody for granted. So I always try to tell players never take anybody for granted in your family when they're there. You never know. I remember playing a game and looking up in the bleachers the first time. I mean, I was an adult at this point. Knows playing men's league. But I remember my dad wasn't in the bleachers.

01:22:53:15 - 01:23:15:00
Unknown
Like, it was just it was it was a national championship here. And my mom was here and my sisters were here, but my dad wasn't here. It was it was weird. It was weird. Totally. I felt good, man. Yeah. It's a family show. It's a family show right now. Dwayne Fine dropped a shit somewhere, so we went PG 13.

01:23:15:00 - 01:23:34:03
Unknown
Now we're like, at our problem. There's no Dwayne Let's shift gears here a little bit if you can. And again, I have some questions that we kind of roll around because I like hearing people's responses to these because everybody has a different response so let's just see. We can go back in time now and talk to 20 year old Dwayne.

01:23:34:03 - 01:23:55:10
Unknown
And what would the advice be given from you now to that 20 year old or younger version of you? Let's not put a label on the danger of young obviously. I think, I think if I had to talk to any 12 year old right now so myself it was be more comfortable around authority, be more comfortable around coaches, you know get to know your coaches.

01:23:55:10 - 01:24:19:23
Unknown
But I think one thing I was, I was I wasn't a follower by any means and I would stand up for what I believe in. But I always like, you know, I was always nervous around coaches. It was awkward around coaches because I, you know, especially in hockey because that's what I want to aspire to continue to do but ask questions, you know, ask questions more and you know, and yeah, I think that would probably the biggest thing.

01:24:19:23 - 01:24:34:02
Unknown
And the other thing, too, is just surround yourself with the right people, you know? And I have great buddies. I got really good friends. I was very fortunate like a really, really good people. Around me. But, you know, you just surround yourself with the right people and make sure that you're you're the one that told it the right way.

01:24:34:11 - 01:24:51:15
Unknown
If whatever your rules are, academics, athletics, whatever that is, just, you know, I think that's that's a big thing. And then honestly, man, like I was I think overall I was a good guy, you know, and there's times probably where I was a little cocky or I was a little, you know, and I think we're all on the Wall Street on this part of living and being, you know, growing up.

01:24:52:24 - 01:25:12:09
Unknown
But yeah, just just kind of enjoying the process. You know, sometimes you want to get to that stage so fast that you kind of missed the gaps in between a little bit. You want to be able to enjoy that a little bit and kind of enjoy the process of that. But the biggest thing is just be confident and be okay with talking to adults and be okay talking to the coaches and things like that.

01:25:12:09 - 01:25:38:08
Unknown
You know, Jojo, you did ever get a chance to watch you play college ball don't even bring that up. So, no, it's a good story. Not really. So he comes my I'm at West Virginia State University game plays out. I think we're down by like runner on second base. We're down by one. I strike out to like to lose the game.

01:25:38:12 - 01:25:55:23
Unknown
Right. Game one of the doubleheader say strike up. My dad's been to like I think three games my entire life of baseball. I've been playing so the same things the I like nine years old. Yeah so after the I'm just more jacked that he's watching me play so after the game I'm like hey you know introducing my my buddies to my dad.

01:25:55:23 - 01:26:13:02
Unknown
It's like, hey this my dad is my dad. Might I want to use his language. But all my like the guys most of the team is around. It's my dad. Like, I'm a proud moment. So they're all that he pride this, right? He waits like everybody's kind of always he looks and he's like, well, you really screwed that one up.

01:26:13:07 - 01:26:32:08
Unknown
Yeah. I was like, oh, my God. You know, I'm so next game, I think I'm hitting three hole at the time. So next game, it's a double header. So it's like, I don't know, maybe half hour in between. Next game, my first at bat, I hit a home run and run in the bases. He's M.I.A. Shows up like this, shows up like a third or fourth inning.

01:26:32:08 - 01:27:08:23
Unknown
I'm like, well, after the game, like, well, I had to go to Shoney's, man. That's a wicked buffet. Shoney's got to be kidding me, right? Oh, so that was the college time he had come see me. Oh, there's no there's no Shoney's up in Sudbury. Shoney's in Sudbury. No, no, no. I couldn't believe it, man. Oh, man. Duane, I appreciate you guys and JD to like the openness and I think it's important that that men talk and we take the opportunity to talk as we do is like sometimes I say we pass by each other in the hallways, and we're doing our jobs, but we don't necessarily take the time to check in with each other

01:27:08:23 - 01:27:23:05
Unknown
and say, men like, how are you doing? Right. Do we actually care about. So this is good, especially this time with the bell let's talk stuff. So here's a shout out. Yeah. It's not a one. It's not a one day thing. It's a it's a 15 days a year. Yeah, well, it should be. That's the way it should be.

01:27:23:05 - 01:27:41:13
Unknown
So, Dwane, one of the things we like to leave for our listeners is well, of course, and I know you like you're going to like this is your chance to be a teacher bell and oh, there you go. I like it. You get a personal pension yeah. So we like to give them something to think about or leave them for something for the next episode in or in between.

01:27:42:08 - 01:28:05:11
Unknown
In your case, what would be the best piece of leadership or coaching advice that you could give somebody who's trying to be a better coach, a better leader, or a better parent, or maybe a resource, a book that you've read or one your best resources or some pearl of wisdom? Give us something we wow, guy. You know what I think?

01:28:06:18 - 01:28:22:13
Unknown
I think honestly, like, you know, being a good coach, number one is, is I think it's changed a lot over the years. I think when we were younger, coaches coach to the group and just coach everyone the same. I think knowing your individuals and getting to know your players as people, you know, and even I like what I do at this level.

01:28:22:13 - 01:28:36:14
Unknown
I'm not the head coach by any means. But I you know, already have some of the guys and all my kids I know one of them just had a baby. I know he's got a girlfriend in town. You know what I mean? So just get to know people as people. Aside from the sport, I think that's a big help as far as coaching.

01:28:37:02 - 01:28:54:17
Unknown
So, you know, just being able to build those relationships that way I think is huge. I think one thing that I've been on and Gigi and I may have talked about like David Goggins, which, you know, and just like sometimes you think you're going hard, but you're not going hard. You don't want to just like can you push a bit harder whether it's a coach?

01:28:55:01 - 01:29:13:01
Unknown
And then I'll be the first to admit, like, I have bad days and there's days where I'm not a good coach these days run. I'm watching too much Netflix or I'm stuck on YouTube for an hour and watching stupid stuff, you know what I mean? Like, that happens. And I and I think but I think that's one thing where, like, sometimes we think we're working hard, but we're not really working not hard, you know?

01:29:13:02 - 01:29:31:05
Unknown
And and I also think the other thing, too, is don't get too caught up with the white noise around you. You know, you see this on YouTube, we see this on Instagram. Really? Oh, my God, this coach is doing this or this guy's got nine pillars like the one time college, you know, but I think like just like don't like really if you accept our.

01:29:31:19 - 01:29:46:19
Unknown
Right. Exactly. No, but like, you know, do the research and be confident what you know, and if you don't know, then go check it out. There's guys like, did you guys like you? There's guys like me. There's people out there that are very open. And, you know, you get emails. I get emails like, yeah, I'll answer it like you know what I mean?

01:29:46:19 - 01:29:58:19
Unknown
So I just think there's people out there that are willing to help and willing to pay it forward and willing to talk to other people about stuff. But but if you're, you know, you're strong what you believe in and you're going to what you do, then just you know, believe in what you do and do do the best you can with it.

01:29:58:19 - 01:30:18:10
Unknown
And don't worry too much about what's going on around you. So I'm assuming that you're referring with David Goggins. That can't hurt me. That book the book, the audio book is actually unbelievable because they have like a little podcast sections in football. It's awesome. It's unreal. And for me, like with him his story is unbelievable. And the guys, the guy's insane.

01:30:18:10 - 01:30:33:20
Unknown
We got to be honest. The guy's nuts, the stuff he's done. But it's just a mentality of when you think you're like all out and your guys there, you're done, your day is done. Like, Oh, my God. Like, No, you got more, man. You can do more if you wanted to, you know, and just understanding kind of how you can push.

01:30:33:20 - 01:30:56:23
Unknown
And I the one thing with him is just some mental toughness piece of it. Like, you know, just cast your mind, like get your mind, heart, you know, and and I think honestly that the only way to do that is to lose. It's a straight with your dads there is to have those shitty over those shitty situation one for two dad passing or death in the family or you get cut from a team or you know, you get dropped to the fourth line like, okay, how am I going to get to that second line?

01:30:56:23 - 01:31:12:23
Unknown
How am I going to get back up there? What am I going to do? And like work hard instead of all, it's my fault. It's his fault. It's this person, you know, just figure it out. I'm complaining. Defend. Yeah. And I can't stand excuses. Like, I really can't. You know, there's a lot of times where I could be maybe blamed on somebody else, but you know what?

01:31:12:23 - 01:31:29:07
Unknown
I got to all knocks. I was, I was by my fault, you know? And I think that that that ownership part that, you know, being accountable is a big, big, big piece. And we had a my my little guys team, I the whole team. And I'm like, you guys all accountable means, like, obviously, some of them do, some of them don't, which is totally fine.

01:31:29:16 - 01:31:42:14
Unknown
And that's why I ask question. But I'm like, it's owning it. Like, you mess up, you own it, and that's okay. We all mess up, you know? But teaching young kids of young age is that I punched the hole in the wall. I threw my sticks through the wall, like, how many kids are going to lie about that?

01:31:42:14 - 01:31:56:21
Unknown
Most kids will say, Well, I'm in trouble, but no, it's okay. You told me we'll fix it all, be fixed, we'll fix it. You know, it's not a big deal. All the dumb stuff, you know, and as a coach, understanding that to where I kick the hole in the wall one time, we all did some stuff, you know, it's okay.

01:31:56:21 - 01:32:02:24
Unknown
We can get through it. It's the lie to me. Stay accountable. Just own it. You know what? I think that's those are kind of big things right?

01:32:05:09 - 01:32:18:01
Unknown
Well, another show that I don't want to end. I just want to I just let's just keep rolling. Keep rolling. And it was one man was good. I'll take care. Take her home and take her. Oh, all right.

01:32:20:06 - 01:32:29:22
Unknown
Well, that does it for this episode of Benchmark. Thanks for listening. Until next time. Keep crushing it. All game.